Searching for an insertable insert stove
Ronald Hongsermeier, July 24, 2008

Tom Reed,

since you are administering this list, I'll address you and paste in my query for the gasifiers list. Since then I have also cut up two Espresso canisters for the fuel-holder/primary/secondary air mix parts of two motor-ventilated turbo stoves (URL below). The cans are different volumes and I spent quite a bit of thought on how to more or less efficiently space, dimension and make the holes (referring to

http://bioenergylists.org/stovesdoc/Anderson/GasifierLAMNET.pdf

for guidance). I've got a cheap caliper and the metal measures at .3mm. I've talked to a nearby "Schlosser" (machinist/welder) and he has introduced me a bit to the complexities of ordering sheet metal which, though I am getting close to 25 years in Germany is a new experience. But I'm getting far ahead of myself. More on this after the main body of my original message.

______________________snip________________________/*new comments since gasifier posting*/

I live and work in Germany. I live in an apartment with a pre-installed Kachelofen: For those who don't do Deutsch this is basically a wood stove with a large ceramic tiled radiator. The stove is fed from the entry hallway of the apartment.

The wood-stove insert is fitted with fire-bricks and the system burns relatively cleanly for a stove with only one primary, /*provided that the air is all the way open*/ but it's too hot when it's working at the heat level it needs to maintain to be least smoky. It produces a large amount of soot and probably quite a bit of tar depending on the wood fired.

For the time being, it's just a frustrated piece of pretty old technology, which isn't convenient enough to expend the effort and expense of gathering dry wood, paying for it, splitting it, storing it, retrieving it from storage, jumping through the hoops of gettting it lit, mothering it to a full burning roar, sitting down for as little as 20 min. to read and then starting over again. It engorges itself on huge amounts of wood and I don't feel comfortable with the huge amount of heat produced and the amount of that overproduced heat that just heats the chimney brick and gets swallowed up in the not so black hole of the atmosphere.

It isn't being used presently because of the necessity to be continually tending it and keeping it going. It basically runs well for about 20min. - 1/2 hr. when using softwood and around 3/4 hour when using oak or more closely grained hardwoods /*like beech*/ before being needed to restoked and have the air-intake reset/babysat.

The price of heating oil here is approaching 1Euro per liter. This is considerable pressure to come up with an idea to be able to use this asset in a way that will not be loads of trouble, not too expensive, maintain safe operation and burn up various woody mass kinds of materials that aren't as much work to handle as split firewood...

I've watched a bunch of videos on the various mini-stoves based on the ideas of people like Dr Reed or Dr Anderson and am wondering if there is any reason _not_ to make an insert-insert along the basic idea of the XXL scaling of the BEG website:

http://www.woodgas.com/bookSTOVE.htm

and just let it run inside the fire chamber of my Kachelofen. The ideal (eventually) would be to also insert a water (or other fluid) -filled heat exchanger and pipe some of the heat to other parts of the apartment, but that can only come after the basic concept is proved. To give some qualifications to the question, so that an overly hasty negative isn't imminent:

The insert has an almost 1 sq-ft. door and the chamber is quite deep. Width is 30cm, hgt c. 50 cm and depth 33cm. The top is somewhat roof-shaped, thus the height being approximate. I just reexamined the insert. The roof-shaped part is the cowling and is over the back half of the insert. This connects to an 18cm OD tube construction that goes into the inside of the hollow Kachel construction about 60cm before feeding into the heat exchanger below it (behind the insert) and then exiting from the heat exchanger into the chimney through another 18cm pipe. The last pipe is around 75cm long.

What I suspect is that as long as I don't radically exceed the 6 kW claimed by the XXL WoodGas Camp Stove I shouldn't run into safety problems or meltdown problems as long as I assure sufficient airflow, since the nominal rating of the insert is around 10 (maybe +/-1)kW.

The whole of the Kachel side, which is in the living room is about 1m x 1.1m x 1.85m, giving it a rather impressive volume.

Am I overlooking something radical/dangerous or might I be on to something useful/helpful?

Thanks in advance,

Ronald W. Hongsermeier, B.S., M.Div, once aspiring boat designer

__________________________snip_________________

Since posting this I've done a ton more reading taking into account some of the equations in Dr. Tom Reed's (with R. Larson)article:

http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/WoodgasStove.pdf

and have made it my goal to get together a workshop during our church youth summer camp in a couple of weeks where the 13-15 year old children can do some stove building from scratch with coffee cans, etc.

The theme of the camp is "ghetto" and there are still places for children open :)

http://www.efg-erding.de/zeltlager/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_download&gid=4&Itemid=29

with hopes that some of them will make the connection not just to daily life here, but also to the developing peoples where such simple innovations could make a radical change in their daily lives.

Anyway, I still have some time and will be assembling tools, making some jigs so the spacing, puncturing and cutting will not be too mentally/physically taxing. I've even come up with an idea for a mechanical air supply pump that's novel (since I'm such a log in this category "novel" only means it's new to me!), just haven't drawn and dimmed/prototyped it yet. We shall see. Any ideas?

For purposes of the list, should this be two topics?

Thanks for allowing me on board!

regards,

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